Artos Academy | Kirby Madren | Activity

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Why would it be important to know that the Lord is in control of our circumstances? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 23 Apr 2024 08:42:32 -0400

Reply to Why would it be important to know that the Lord is in control of our circumstances?

Worry, I usually don’t worry much about most things, this is something God has blessed me tremendously. But when it comes to providing for my family even I am not the breadwinner, and also the future of relationships I have alot more concern to the point of being anxious and often questioning myself if I did the right thing. Doing my best,…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion What in the notes did you find revealing, interesting or challenging? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 23 Apr 2024 08:06:04 -0400

Reply to What in the notes did you find revealing, interesting or challenging?

Not much new info, I’ve been taught this most of my life; but very interesting how we view God affects our attitude and determines how we live. But what does this mean for free will… not sure what I think. Another very interesting thing, though I’ve been taught it, that God is in control of EVERYTHING, good and bad. Allowing things to happen…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Based on your current circumstances, what do you think the Lord wants you to do with His money? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 16 Apr 2024 07:18:37 -0400

Reply to Based on your current circumstances, what do you think the Lord wants you to do with His money?

This is tough, I do agree being a good steward, but I need to learn more.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion How have you seen money being a competitor with Jesus in people's lives today? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 16 Apr 2024 07:15:14 -0400

Reply to How have you seen money being a competitor with Jesus in people's lives today?

‘Chasing the dream’ and ‘Keep up with the Jones’ are 2 slogans that come to mind. How we choose to handle money drastically affects who we are. It’s not always bad, but 1 common thing is emphasis on me.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion What in the notes did you find revealing, interesting or challenging? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 16 Apr 2024 07:06:42 -0400

Reply to What in the notes did you find revealing, interesting or challenging?

“God, what do you want me to do with my money?” vs “God, what do you want me to do with your money?” I had heard this before, but I also recognize all good gifts come from God (James 1:17), so my thinking was/is he gave to me not lent to me, so how can I please him with it? Pressure is on me to make the decision… Is recognizing His…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In the video presentation, Alice Mathews said, “But what is striking to me is as I look in the gospels, is the fact that even though the religious leaders of the day criticized Jesus soundly for breaking the Sabbath, for drinking too much wine, for associating with all the wrong people, tax collectors and other disreputable types, at no point was there any hint that anything improper took place. Jesus’ relationships with women, while He was warm and caring, nevertheless always were conducted in ways that were completely without reproach.” What is your reaction to this statement? Do you agree or disagree? Why? How would you respond to someone whose view is different than yours? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 09 Apr 2024 08:16:42 -0400

Reply to In the video presentation, Alice Mathews said, “But what is striking to me is as I look in the gospels, is the fact that even though the religious leaders of the day criticized Jesus soundly for breaking the Sabbath, for drinking too much wine, for associating with all the wrong people, tax collectors and other disreputable types, at no point was there any hint that anything improper took place. Jesus’ relationships with women, while He was warm and caring, nevertheless always were conducted in ways that were completely without reproach.” What is your reaction to this statement? Do you agree or disagree? Why? How would you respond to someone whose view is different than yours?

Agree, because Jesus said he is God, and God is love; also, the evidence in the gospels agrees with her statement. To someone who disagrees – being as loving as I can ask “Why is that? What evidence leads you to believe that?”

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In the video presentation, Richard Abanes said this. “The story in The Da Vinci Code is actually quite fascinating. It supposedly gives the true origins of Christianity and says that Jesus Christ was actually married to Mary Magdalene, they had a child and that the whole lineage of Jesus Christ grew up in France and intermingled with French royalty and that the descendents actually still exist to this day.” How does it contrast with the view you originally held concerning Mary Magdalene and the ministry of Jesus Christ? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 09 Apr 2024 05:28:31 -0400

Reply to In the video presentation, Richard Abanes said this. “The story in The Da Vinci Code is actually quite fascinating. It supposedly gives the true origins of Christianity and says that Jesus Christ was actually married to Mary Magdalene, they had a child and that the whole lineage of Jesus Christ grew up in France and intermingled with French royalty and that the descendents actually still exist to this day.” How does it contrast with the view you originally held concerning Mary Magdalene and the ministry of Jesus Christ?

I grew up thinking that Jesus was single, however this theory says married. Not much emphasis was ever given to this topic probably due to the insignificant theories on it? But I was also taught that Jesus was fully God and fully Man, and (not saying I believe this) if Jesus was married what would that prove except that he married like men do?…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In the video presentation, Richard Abanes said this. “The story in The Da Vinci Code is actually quite fascinating. It supposedly gives the true origins of Christianity and says that Jesus Christ was actually married to Mary Magdalene, they had a child and that the whole lineage of Jesus Christ grew up in France and intermingled with French royalty and that the descendents actually still exist to this day.” Had you heard this theory before? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 09 Apr 2024 05:16:22 -0400

Outside of The Da Vinci Code, I have not heard this theory.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In the video presentation, Paul Maier described what would have been the account if Peter and the other disciples had invented the resurrection story. They, not the women, would have been the first eyewitnesses. What do you think of Paul Maier’s conclusion concerning the witness of the women? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 19 Mar 2024 08:46:59 -0400

Reply to In the video presentation, Paul Maier described what would have been the account if Peter and the other disciples had invented the resurrection story. They, not the women, would have been the first eyewitnesses. What do you think of Paul Maier’s conclusion concerning the witness of the women?

Very logical. If women and women’s testimony was disregarded as not valuable, then why were they the 1st on the scene? Man’s ways are NOT God’s way!

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In the video presentation, Mart De Haan said, “According to The Da Vinci Code, Constantine commissioned and then financed his own version of the Bible that downplayed the human traits of Christ and embellished those stories that portrayed him as divine.” Why would today’s public be willing to deem feasible the allegation that Constantine sponsored his own Bible? in the forum Discussion Forum

Mon, 18 Mar 2024 06:48:54 -0400

Reply to In the video presentation, Mart De Haan said, “According to The Da Vinci Code, Constantine commissioned and then financed his own version of the Bible that downplayed the human traits of Christ and embellished those stories that portrayed him as divine.” Why would today’s public be willing to deem feasible the allegation that Constantine sponsored his own Bible?

If he paid for it, people think he’s getting something for it. While that [previous] is true I understand it is not the reason most people think – the usual suspects Money, Power, Sex type. I’m not well studied on this yet, but I understand there were very fundamental issues causing strife in the empire, and by commissioning this council it…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In the video presentation, Mart De Haan said, “According to The Da Vinci Code, Constantine commissioned and then financed his own version of the Bible that downplayed the human traits of Christ and embellished those stories that portrayed him as divine.” What do you do when you hear a truth-claim about history that you are not sure of? in the forum Discussion Forum

Mon, 18 Mar 2024 06:32:15 -0400

Reply to In the video presentation, Mart De Haan said, “According to The Da Vinci Code, Constantine commissioned and then financed his own version of the Bible that downplayed the human traits of Christ and embellished those stories that portrayed him as divine.” What do you do when you hear a truth-claim about history that you are not sure of?

If it is of interest, usually a thought – “REALLY?”, maybe some non verbal head/face motion, then a question “Where/How did you get that? (if available), followed by a “Hmm” and “Let me check”. When I was younger, I regrettably didn’t follow up much, but now I would do some research on the subject. I’m learning to try to ask more…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Greek Scholar Daniel Wallace said, “When the King James was done, it was especially based on about a half of a dozen manuscripts. The earliest of which was a thousand years after the New Testament was written. Today we have approximately 1000 times as many manuscripts that we know exist. And our earliest ones go all the way back to the 2nd century. …Within decades of when the New Testament was written.” Why is it significant that we have manuscripts that go back to within decades after the New Testament was written? in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 13 Mar 2024 07:46:59 -0400

Reply to Greek Scholar Daniel Wallace said, “When the King James was done, it was especially based on about a half of a dozen manuscripts. The earliest of which was a thousand years after the New Testament was written. Today we have approximately 1000 times as many manuscripts that we know exist. And our earliest ones go all the way back to the 2nd century. …Within decades of when the New Testament was written.” Why is it significant that we have manuscripts that go back to within decades after the New Testament was written?

The earlier the written account, the less problems that can/could arise between the actual event and transcription. Other topic lessons have covered that there was a strong oral tradition, but after a few decades it was decided to transcribe their words. Logically the copies would come after the originals, and many early copies were…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Richard Abanes said, “ The Gnostic Gospels…are key to The Da Vinci Code. The Gnostics were a group of people in the early history of the church who sort of took basic Christian ideas and blended them with their own thoughts on spirituality and the world. And they wrote their own gospels, writings that talked about Jesus Christ. But [The Gnostic Gospels] were not written until 250 to 350 A.D. and they were rejected by early church leaders.” Why do you think The Gnostic Gospels being written between 250 and 350 A. D. is a problem for what these documents claim to be? in the forum Discussion Forum

Mon, 11 Mar 2024 06:31:18 -0400

Reply to Richard Abanes said, “ The Gnostic Gospels…are key to The Da Vinci Code. The Gnostics were a group of people in the early history of the church who sort of took basic Christian ideas and blended them with their own thoughts on spirituality and the world. And they wrote their own gospels, writings that talked about Jesus Christ. But [The Gnostic Gospels] were not written until 250 to 350 A.D. and they were rejected by early church leaders.” Why do you think The Gnostic Gospels being written between 250 and 350 A. D. is a problem for what these documents claim to be?

Timing is critical. For authenticity sake the gospels written in the 1st century have the clear advantage for recording the actual message and events. The gnostics written in the 3rd and 4th century can’t compare. If trying to deceive then allowing more time to pass is important – eye-witnesses are gone, details get blurry or even fabricated…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion The Da Vinci Code makes this claim: “Man created [the Bible] as a historical record of tumultuous times, and it has evolved through countless translations, additions, and revisions. History has never had a definitive version of the book” (p. 231). Does the Bible claim to be only the creation of man? Explain. in the forum Discussion Forum

Mon, 04 Mar 2024 07:34:53 -0500

Reply to The Da Vinci Code makes this claim: “Man created [the Bible] as a historical record of tumultuous times, and it has evolved through countless translations, additions, and revisions. History has never had a definitive version of the book” (p. 231). Does the Bible claim to be only the creation of man? Explain.

Men wrote it, but it is not only the creation of man – see 2 Peter 1

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion J. P. Moreland said, “When God wants to get our attention, He typically doesn’t shout at us; He does that occasionally, but typically He tries to do gentle reminders that He’s there—that give us a chance to resist them if we want to or to follow them. He very often then will use pain; He’ll use circumstances in our lives to awaken us to His presence and to awaken us to questions that will lead us to Him.” Do you agree with this? Why or why not? How has God obtained your attention? in the forum Discussion Forum

Fri, 02 Feb 2024 09:42:34 -0500

Reply to J. P. Moreland said, “When God wants to get our attention, He typically doesn’t shout at us; He does that occasionally, but typically He tries to do gentle reminders that He’s there—that give us a chance to resist them if we want to or to follow them. He very often then will use pain; He’ll use circumstances in our lives to awaken us to His presence and to awaken us to questions that will lead us to Him.” Do you agree with this? Why or why not? How has God obtained your attention?

Very true, as a parent I find it very easy to raise my voice out of frustration because I want my kids to hear me. But getting their attention out of fear is not always helpful; when they are “out of harm’s way” it is very easy to go back to same thing. However if do something to make them think different it often produces better results.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Dallas Willard said, “The challenge has been whether or not we were going to be god or allow God to be God. And to be god in a very important sense means I get to do what I want. And reason teaches me, inescapably, that I am not God. And so it all comes home right to the point where you find in the Gospels the talk about accepting the cross, giving up one’s life, and then finding a new life.” Describe a time in your life when you wanted to be in control of your life instead of letting God be in control. Were you happy at that time? Have you since allowed Christ to be Lord of your life? in the forum Discussion Forum

Fri, 02 Feb 2024 09:35:23 -0500

Reply to Dallas Willard said, “The challenge has been whether or not we were going to be god or allow God to be God. And to be god in a very important sense means I get to do what I want. And reason teaches me, inescapably, that I am not God. And so it all comes home right to the point where you find in the Gospels the talk about accepting the cross, giving up one’s life, and then finding a new life.” Describe a time in your life when you wanted to be in control of your life instead of letting God be in control. Were you happy at that time? Have you since allowed Christ to be Lord of your life?

I’ve never really been seeking control of much. Of course I had aspirations and goals and I don’t think they were sinful, but they were my plans, not from God. After recommitting my life to Him, I truly have felt a change of heart and my desires are very different. Not to say I wouldn’t still like them, but they are no longer the driving forces…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Ray Bolin said, “You pick a rock out of a stream bed, and it’s got little chisels and chips in it, an archaeologist would be able to come along and tell you whether that was done with a purpose, intelligently to make an arrowhead or some other stone tool, or whether it’s just the forces of water and rocks acting together. We can tell the difference between something which is intelligently designed and something that is not." If this is the case, why do you think so many scientists look at design in creation and deny a Creator? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 16 Jan 2024 07:28:47 -0500

Reply to Ray Bolin said, “You pick a rock out of a stream bed, and it’s got little chisels and chips in it, an archaeologist would be able to come along and tell you whether that was done with a purpose, intelligently to make an arrowhead or some other stone tool, or whether it’s just the forces of water and rocks acting together. We can tell the difference between something which is intelligently designed and something that is not." If this is the case, why do you think so many scientists look at design in creation and deny a Creator?

Their heart. They want to be in control, so they deny any aspect of God.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Kerby Anderson made this comment: “And we recognize that as we look at nature, that diversity, that design, that order just can’t come about by chance. We’ve never seen a tornado go through a junkyard and construct a 747 jet. We’ve never seen an explosion in a print factory producing Webster’s Unabridged Dictionary. The more order and complexity and design that we see in nature, the more it argues for a Designer that brought it into being.” Do you think his illustrations about the 747 jet and Webster’s Unabridged Dictionary are valid? Explain why or why not. in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 16 Jan 2024 07:22:26 -0500

Reply to Kerby Anderson made this comment: “And we recognize that as we look at nature, that diversity, that design, that order just can’t come about by chance. We’ve never seen a tornado go through a junkyard and construct a 747 jet. We’ve never seen an explosion in a print factory producing Webster’s Unabridged Dictionary. The more order and complexity and design that we see in nature, the more it argues for a Designer that brought it into being.” Do you think his illustrations about the 747 jet and Webster’s Unabridged Dictionary are valid? Explain why or why not.

If the skeptic wanted to prove something, these examples may be obsevered if someone tries the experiment (but who honestly attempt it???) From a statistical point the chance of getting the desired results are so unlikely it’s compared to theories for the beginning of the universe. From this angle I think the examples are valid. However, we…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion J. P. Moreland said, “We’re convinced now that the universe that we live in is ordered and balanced and began. Something had to begin it that was intelligent enough to bring it into existence and to give it the kind of design and order that it has.” Do you believe this statement is self-evident to all? Why or why not? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 16 Jan 2024 07:09:56 -0500

Reply to J. P. Moreland said, “We’re convinced now that the universe that we live in is ordered and balanced and began. Something had to begin it that was intelligent enough to bring it into existence and to give it the kind of design and order that it has.” Do you believe this statement is self-evident to all? Why or why not?

Yes I believe the universe had a beginning and God created it. I don’t know that and am told that I’m unable to reason that from rational evidence. However, even not believing in God has resulted in theories and studies to how the universe began. We are here, we had to have started sometime (infinity past wouldn’t allow us to reach now). Just…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Darrell Bock said, “Jesus actually shows who He is more by what He does, than what He says.” By raising the dead, healing diseases, and calming the storm, Jesus shows Himself to be God. How credible would Jesus’ claims have been had He not performed such miracles? in the forum Discussion Forum

Sat, 13 Jan 2024 06:43:06 -0500

Reply to Darrell Bock said, “Jesus actually shows who He is more by what He does, than what He says.” By raising the dead, healing diseases, and calming the storm, Jesus shows Himself to be God. How credible would Jesus’ claims have been had He not performed such miracles?

Is it easier to forgive sins or say to get up and walk? the miracle when Jesus says this comes to mind. Anyone can talk a big game, but only by doing and showing can you back it up. Jesus talked the biggest game in history, and he still backed it up. That should give you pause for thought.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Darrell Bock further stated, “I think that sometimes we give this portrait of the ancient person and this gullibility to miracles as the impression that there’s nothing too surprising happening in Scripture in the portrait of Jesus for an ancient person. When in fact all these accounts talk about the shock and awe and surprise and in fact it’s part of what drew attention to Jesus and what He was doing was so unusual.” Has anyone ever spoken to you about the miracles of Jesus as a fairy tale or myth that belongs to a simpler pre-scientific age? How would you respond to someone who made such a statement? in the forum Discussion Forum

Sat, 13 Jan 2024 06:35:31 -0500

Reply to Darrell Bock further stated, “I think that sometimes we give this portrait of the ancient person and this gullibility to miracles as the impression that there’s nothing too surprising happening in Scripture in the portrait of Jesus for an ancient person. When in fact all these accounts talk about the shock and awe and surprise and in fact it’s part of what drew attention to Jesus and what He was doing was so unusual.” Has anyone ever spoken to you about the miracles of Jesus as a fairy tale or myth that belongs to a simpler pre-scientific age? How would you respond to someone who made such a statement?

Question – Do they believe in God, and what is their definition of God vs my definition? The presupposition is very important and their answer will determine my response. If you believe in God then believing in miracles should be default. Going at this from a scientific angle may be too difficult, because miracles by definition are outside…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In his book Mere Christianity, C. S. Lewis points out that when someone makes the kinds of claims that Jesus made you can’t simply consider him a good moral teacher. He never left that option open to us. So He is either the Lord, a liar, or a lunatic. Do you agree with this line of reasoning? Why? in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 03 Jan 2024 06:55:56 -0500

Reply to In his book Mere Christianity, C. S. Lewis points out that when someone makes the kinds of claims that Jesus made you can’t simply consider him a good moral teacher. He never left that option open to us. So He is either the Lord, a liar, or a lunatic. Do you agree with this line of reasoning? Why?

This line of reasoning seems very sound. There are 2 outright answers – YES or NO, and a 3rd possibility for mentally handicapped (another conceived possibility was that he was forced to say these things, but this seems so far from a possibility and never heard of any evidence for this). So he is or he isn’t, he’s outright deceiving, not…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Darrell Bock asked the question, “How does Jesus portray Himself in the Gospels?” Darrell pointed to key claims that identify Jesus as the Son of God and as One with the Father. Click on the link to go directly to John 10:27-31 What does Jesus mean by the statement “I and My Father are One”? How do you respond to this claim? in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 03 Jan 2024 06:43:55 -0500

Reply to Darrell Bock asked the question, “How does Jesus portray Himself in the Gospels?” Darrell pointed to key claims that identify Jesus as the Son of God and as One with the Father. Click on the link to go directly to John 10:27-31 What does Jesus mean by the statement “I and My Father are One”? How do you respond to this claim?

God said it, that settles it. I can choose to accept or reject. God has already appointed that at the name of Jesus all must bow. So I choose to accept Him as my Lord and Savior.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Dallas Willard talks about a complete skeptic being asked to pray “the atheist’s prayer.” “O my God, if there is a God, save my soul, if I have a soul.” He goes on to say what a surprise it is to see those who have prayed that prayer as a first step eventually come to faith in Christ. Why do you think this occurs? in the forum Discussion Forum

Mon, 11 Dec 2023 07:42:03 -0500

Reply to Dallas Willard talks about a complete skeptic being asked to pray “the atheist’s prayer.” “O my God, if there is a God, save my soul, if I have a soul.” He goes on to say what a surprise it is to see those who have prayed that prayer as a first step eventually come to faith in Christ. Why do you think this occurs?

This atheist is completely desperate. God knows what little people need to grasp onto hope. God also knows who needs them to change. Just little morsels not huge signs, and it’s probable not even something new, just something they have overlooked.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Without a Creator, how does science explain ultimate origins? in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 06 Dec 2023 06:53:13 -0500

Reply to Without a Creator, how does science explain ultimate origins?

With contradictory explanations… nothing rational.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Jerry Solomon argues from the axiom “from nothing comes nothing” to argue for the existence of an eternal God. Since living things are made of DNA and it carries information, why is this significant from a creationist point of view? in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 06 Dec 2023 06:50:31 -0500

Reply to Jerry Solomon argues from the axiom “from nothing comes nothing” to argue for the existence of an eternal God. Since living things are made of DNA and it carries information, why is this significant from a creationist point of view?

DNA is encoded information in our cells. Information must come from a rational source… a.k.a. a mind!

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Frank Pastore believes that life popping into existence is a second Big Bang. Why do you agree or disagree with this? in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 06 Dec 2023 06:48:10 -0500

Reply to Frank Pastore believes that life popping into existence is a second Big Bang. Why do you agree or disagree with this?

I haven’t heard this argument before, but it makes sense to me. The probability of the first big bang is unlikely enough. However, his argument was how could you get all 3 of those things mentioned from just 1 big bang?… Not probable, so why not add another big bang. Ridiculous!

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion According to Ray Bolin, what did Darwin “get right” about his observations on natural selection? Where did Darwin go wrong? in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 06 Dec 2023 06:38:56 -0500

Reply to According to Ray Bolin, what did Darwin “get right” about his observations on natural selection? Where did Darwin go wrong?

It sounds like he observed and quantified several things correctly, including natural selection and species adaptation to different environments (small adaptations). But he assumed the majority of his theory by going beyond the facts of his collected data. From what I understand, he assumed time would allow for the “missing links” to be found…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion According to J. P. Moreland, “We know…that we have minds and souls…that we are moral creatures. Do you agree with Moreland’s conclusions? Explain how these observations might be used to argue for the existence of the God revealed in the Christian Scriptures. in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 05 Dec 2023 08:26:55 -0500

Reply to According to J. P. Moreland, “We know…that we have minds and souls…that we are moral creatures. Do you agree with Moreland’s conclusions? Explain how these observations might be used to argue for the existence of the God revealed in the Christian Scriptures.

I agree that we have a mind and soul, and that we are moral creatures; so the anthropological argument could be a starting point. But some [naturalists] may claim they do not exist (i.e. the soul) or are relative(i.e. morals), convincing them could lead to a debate (not my strongpoint).

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion A telescope can show us things far away and a microscope can reveal things that are very small. But no one has ever come up with a “God scope” to see if there is a God. If God exists, why does He dwell outside our ability to see Him with scientific instruments? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 14 Nov 2023 07:35:38 -0500

Reply to A telescope can show us things far away and a microscope can reveal things that are very small. But no one has ever come up with a “God scope” to see if there is a God. If God exists, why does He dwell outside our ability to see Him with scientific instruments?

If it was SO evident (100% proof) that God exists, then why would we need faith in Him? Faith placed correctly in Him is what pleases Him. He gave us the free will to come to our own conclusion based on the circumstantial evidence.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Why do those who are anti-religious seem to be unaware of their own exercise of faith? What rationalizations might secular people use to defend their views? in the forum Discussion Forum

Mon, 06 Nov 2023 06:51:32 -0500

Reply to Why do those who are anti-religious seem to be unaware of their own exercise of faith? What rationalizations might secular people use to defend their views?

Because in their mind believing in a religion is ultimately faith in something you can’t see; materialism doesn’t allow for that, everything must have a naturalistic answer.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion What difference would it make if people became more aware of how much they continually exercise faith in daily living? The video presentation suggested that people tend to make gods in their own image. What is the significance of this? in the forum Discussion Forum

Mon, 06 Nov 2023 06:46:01 -0500

Reply to What difference would it make if people became more aware of how much they continually exercise faith in daily living? The video presentation suggested that people tend to make gods in their own image. What is the significance of this?

If people realized they exercised so much faith, they may choose to examine and scrutinize that belief system more than they think they have if at all.

Gods in their own image – makes them feel a bit more than what they actually are. Then pride creeps in, and that leads to a multitude of downfalls.

The user: Kirby Madren bought Gift Certificate - 1 Year, Gift Certificate - 1 Month

Fri, 03 Nov 2023 06:46:49 -0400

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Dr. Vernon Grounds said, “I might find it difficult to believe in the resurrection of just an ordinary individual. But Jesus wasn’t an ordinary individual…. Everything about Jesus was supernatural, and consequently I find the resurrection to fit right into that picture: Supernatural exit from time/space, the resurrection, and then the ascension. So the resurrection fits beautifully into that whole mosaic. If you were to leave that aside, the jigsaw puzzle would be missing a very significant piece. But it all fits together into a coherent pattern of supernaturalism.” Vernon Grounds uses the illustrations of a mosaic and jigsaw puzzle. How do these metaphors illustrate the miraculous ministry of Jesus Christ ending in His resurrection? Explain your answer. in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 01 Nov 2023 06:52:59 -0400

Reply to Dr. Vernon Grounds said, “I might find it difficult to believe in the resurrection of just an ordinary individual. But Jesus wasn’t an ordinary individual…. Everything about Jesus was supernatural, and consequently I find the resurrection to fit right into that picture: Supernatural exit from time/space, the resurrection, and then the ascension. So the resurrection fits beautifully into that whole mosaic. If you were to leave that aside, the jigsaw puzzle would be missing a very significant piece. But it all fits together into a coherent pattern of supernaturalism.” Vernon Grounds uses the illustrations of a mosaic and jigsaw puzzle. How do these metaphors illustrate the miraculous ministry of Jesus Christ ending in His resurrection? Explain your answer.

The way I understand it as a mosaic is that everything Christ did or was a part of is like a special piece, technically correct and skillfully made exactly as intended no matter what size. The virgin birth, miracles, death, resurrection and ascension are the obvious larger pieces. Altogether they create the beautiful complete image.…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion J. P. Moreland said, “The New Testament writers say, ‘These things were not done in a corner [Acts 26:26], they were done in public, and you know,’ they say to their audience, ‘that these things really happened.’ Why that is so important is this, when it comes to the New Testament, the miracles of Jesus are actually signs that He was who He claimed to be. Jesus repeatedly said, ‘Don’t believe Me because of my words. Don’t believe Me because I say I’m a prophet from God or that I’m His Son. Believe Me because the signs I do simply can’t be explained if I’m simply a man.’ ” What would be the significance of miracles done publicly instead of privately? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 31 Oct 2023 06:42:28 -0400

Reply to J. P. Moreland said, “The New Testament writers say, ‘These things were not done in a corner [Acts 26:26], they were done in public, and you know,’ they say to their audience, ‘that these things really happened.’ Why that is so important is this, when it comes to the New Testament, the miracles of Jesus are actually signs that He was who He claimed to be. Jesus repeatedly said, ‘Don’t believe Me because of my words. Don’t believe Me because I say I’m a prophet from God or that I’m His Son. Believe Me because the signs I do simply can’t be explained if I’m simply a man.’ ” What would be the significance of miracles done publicly instead of privately?

Miracles publicly done with widespread witness could not be denied and hard to ignore. Privately done miracles could be denied much easier and very likely ignored. One reason I think miracles were done publicly instead of privately is to provide another reason we are “without excuse”.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Darrell Bock said, “The question is often asked, ‘Why did the Jews get so upset with Jesus? Why did they crucify Him?’…The question is asked, ‘Are you the Messiah? The Son of God?’ The priest asked the question. And Jesus replies by saying that He’s going to be seated. They’re going to see the Son of Man seated at the right hand of the Father coming on the clouds. And then the priest rips his garments, because for him that was blasphemous.” How does this reaction of Jesus’ enemies refute the idea that the church invented the idea of Jesus’ divinity long after His death? Explain your answer. in the forum Discussion Forum

Fri, 20 Oct 2023 07:30:22 -0400

Reply to Darrell Bock said, “The question is often asked, ‘Why did the Jews get so upset with Jesus? Why did they crucify Him?’…The question is asked, ‘Are you the Messiah? The Son of God?’ The priest asked the question. And Jesus replies by saying that He’s going to be seated. They’re going to see the Son of Man seated at the right hand of the Father coming on the clouds. And then the priest rips his garments, because for him that was blasphemous.” How does this reaction of Jesus’ enemies refute the idea that the church invented the idea of Jesus’ divinity long after His death? Explain your answer.

After Jesus’s words in John 8:58 and 10:30 the religious leaders picked up stones [to kill him], but it was not yet His time. They took the next step in this passage because it was the will of God. This process of events was recorded and was their justification for their actions. Jesus Himself claimed to be God to his enemies at that time, but…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion J. P. Moreland also commented, “We know some things about Jesus from outside of the New Testament. But the best sources of information about Jesus turned out to be the New Testament documents, because they were written by eyewitnesses who knew Jesus and who lived side by side with Him when He lived and ministered in Palestine in the first part of the first century. So the New Testament is the best source of information we have about who Jesus was.” Why should we accept the disciples’ written record of Jesus of Nazareth? Explain your answer. in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 17 Oct 2023 07:41:16 -0400

Reply to J. P. Moreland also commented, “We know some things about Jesus from outside of the New Testament. But the best sources of information about Jesus turned out to be the New Testament documents, because they were written by eyewitnesses who knew Jesus and who lived side by side with Him when He lived and ministered in Palestine in the first part of the first century. So the New Testament is the best source of information we have about who Jesus was.” Why should we accept the disciples’ written record of Jesus of Nazareth? Explain your answer.

“Why should we accept” infers that we are the judge. Each person has choice to accept or reject the information they receive. It seems rational to choose to believe an eye-witness who was a close follower and friend over someone else making claims about that person; but the eye-witnesses should also be tested. If the eye-witnesses are…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In the interview with Chaim Richman, he was quoted as saying, “If we want to define what Jewish history is really all about, the existence of the Jewish people is in itself the greatest proof that God exists.” How could he make such a claim? in the forum Discussion Forum

Fri, 08 Sep 2023 07:39:45 -0400

Reply to In the interview with Chaim Richman, he was quoted as saying, “If we want to define what Jewish history is really all about, the existence of the Jewish people is in itself the greatest proof that God exists.” How could he make such a claim?

I agree with answer. God made a promise to Abraham, the father of the Jewish nation; and has followed through on that promise no matter what or how unlikely humans thought they would survive.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Darrell Bock said,“Jesus actually shows who He is more by what He does, than what He says. He lets His actions speak for whatever words He might have said…When He forgives sins, or exorcises demons, or raises people from the dead, or calms the winds, He is saying, ‘I am the One who is sent by God and have the authority of God. I am the Son of God.’ ” What would His divine claims amount to without this kind of supernatural endorsement? Explain the basis of your view. in the forum Discussion Forum

Thu, 31 Aug 2023 07:37:05 -0400

Reply to Darrell Bock said,“Jesus actually shows who He is more by what He does, than what He says. He lets His actions speak for whatever words He might have said…When He forgives sins, or exorcises demons, or raises people from the dead, or calms the winds, He is saying, ‘I am the One who is sent by God and have the authority of God. I am the Son of God.’ ” What would His divine claims amount to without this kind of supernatural endorsement? Explain the basis of your view.

If you or anyone is “all talk and no walk” then there is no credibility; but if you “walk the walk” along with your talk then you have credibility. But even if you gain all the credibility, there will be those with bias against you.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion According to Edwin Yamauchi: “The Christmas Magi are often described as wise men or kings. But it’s fairly evident that they were astrologers because of what the word meant in the first century.…And in the 5th century bc when Herodotus wrote, the Magi were a priestly cast of the Medes who served the Persians to offer sacrifice as diviners to foretell the future.” By providing a supernatural star to guide the Magi to the Christ child, does this mean God endorses the practice of astrology? Explain your view. in the forum Discussion Forum

Sun, 06 Aug 2023 07:42:42 -0400

Reply to According to Edwin Yamauchi: “The Christmas Magi are often described as wise men or kings. But it’s fairly evident that they were astrologers because of what the word meant in the first century.…And in the 5th century bc when Herodotus wrote, the Magi were a priestly cast of the Medes who served the Persians to offer sacrifice as diviners to foretell the future.” By providing a supernatural star to guide the Magi to the Christ child, does this mean God endorses the practice of astrology? Explain your view.

No it doesn’t mean He endorses it, but He can use anything to accomplish His will. As Joseph said in Genesis (I’m paraphrasing) – what you meant for evil, God used for good.

Does this mean the ends justifies the means? No. This is comparing our will to God’s will (not exactly apples to apples). We should always strive to do what is good…

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion According to Gerry Breshears, “When the angels appeared to the shepherds, they came to the lowest rank of Jewish society. Shepherds, because of the [their] contact with blood,…are completely defiled and unable to keep the ceremonial law of the Jews [i.e., a Jewish person who has contact with blood would not be allowed to go through the Temple ceremony until they had been cleansed]. This is appropriate that the Lamb of God is going to come to a defiled, unclean, and sinful people to cleanse them.” How does the picture of holy angels announcing the coming of a Savior to shepherds apply to each of us? in the forum Discussion Forum

Sat, 08 Jul 2023 09:17:41 -0400

Reply to According to Gerry Breshears, “When the angels appeared to the shepherds, they came to the lowest rank of Jewish society. Shepherds, because of the [their] contact with blood,…are completely defiled and unable to keep the ceremonial law of the Jews [i.e., a Jewish person who has contact with blood would not be allowed to go through the Temple ceremony until they had been cleansed]. This is appropriate that the Lamb of God is going to come to a defiled, unclean, and sinful people to cleanse them.” How does the picture of holy angels announcing the coming of a Savior to shepherds apply to each of us?

We are all unrighteous and unable to get into Heaven by ourselves. God knows this and therefore did everything needed to provide us the gift of salvation. Are we humble enough to accept it?

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Tue, 20 Jun 2023 05:57:49 -0400

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Dr. Vernon Grounds said,“I’m not a Christian because I happened to be born in a so-called Christian country. I’m not a Christian because my parents, when I was a child, may have carried me into a church where I was baptized. I’m not a Christian because now on occasion I will attend a religious service in some church that is supposedly, nominally, and maybe truly Christian. No, I’m a Christian because I have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Savior.” Do you agree with Grounds’ statement: “I’m a Christian because I have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Savior”? Explain your response. in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 24 May 2023 06:48:21 -0400

Reply to Dr. Vernon Grounds said,“I’m not a Christian because I happened to be born in a so-called Christian country. I’m not a Christian because my parents, when I was a child, may have carried me into a church where I was baptized. I’m not a Christian because now on occasion I will attend a religious service in some church that is supposedly, nominally, and maybe truly Christian. No, I’m a Christian because I have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Savior.” Do you agree with Grounds’ statement: “I’m a Christian because I have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Savior”? Explain your response.

Agree 100%, it is a personal decision to accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. The saying ‘God doesn’t have any grandkids’ applies very well to this. Being born into Christian family is a wonderful start, but it doesn’t save you and EVERYONE must make this decision for themselves.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion From an historic perspective, Vernon Grounds spoke of the influence of the Christian faith:“Along came Christianity and it produced change, remarkable change. It abolished the unthinkable powers of gladiatorial conflicts in the Roman arena. It elevated the position of women. It eliminated the abandonment of children, born and then left to die because they were unwanted. It spearheaded the establishment of hospitals and of schools and of orphanages.” Why did the Christian faith tend to transform the culture where it resided? in the forum Discussion Forum

Thu, 18 May 2023 07:22:32 -0400

Reply to From an historic perspective, Vernon Grounds spoke of the influence of the Christian faith:“Along came Christianity and it produced change, remarkable change. It abolished the unthinkable powers of gladiatorial conflicts in the Roman arena. It elevated the position of women. It eliminated the abandonment of children, born and then left to die because they were unwanted. It spearheaded the establishment of hospitals and of schools and of orphanages.” Why did the Christian faith tend to transform the culture where it resided?

A life surrendered to Christ changes the individual which affects the family and community, then the society which pressures the government to act more justly resulting in a more peaceful society that inspires creativity. I like how Luis summed it up (though not in my run on sentence).

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Vernon Grounds comments, “Is the world improving? Is mankind making progress? Technologically, yes; morally, no. Alas, the 20th century is perhaps the bloodiest century in all recorded time. You look at what’s transpiring around the world and, except for the promise of God and His ultimate purpose, you might succumb to despair.” Why can a Christian and an atheist both agree on a human nature with destructive tendencies? in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 17 May 2023 06:43:19 -0400

Reply to Vernon Grounds comments, “Is the world improving? Is mankind making progress? Technologically, yes; morally, no. Alas, the 20th century is perhaps the bloodiest century in all recorded time. You look at what’s transpiring around the world and, except for the promise of God and His ultimate purpose, you might succumb to despair.” Why can a Christian and an atheist both agree on a human nature with destructive tendencies?

From a Christian worldview, the fall of mankind explains the destructive tendencies. From and Atheist worldview they need to take God out of the equation; I assume from looking at the pattern of moral decline, seeing countries rise and fall, this downward trend only predicts a demise. I would guess their optimistic point would be something… Read more

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Doug Groothuis said, “The Christian faith’s analysis of human nature, I think, is incredibly compelling, because it takes seriously both our limitations and our moral failings, our failures, in many ways, and also takes very seriously our dignity, and our value, and our significance. It doesn’t emphasize one at the expense of the other. Blaise Pascal said we are like deposed kings. And what he means is that biblically we’re not the process of chance evolution, we’re not just an evolved ape…Neither are we gods and goddesses. We’re made in the image and likeness of God. We reflect something of God. We’re rational beings. We’re moral beings. We have purpose, we have intentions, but we’ve also gone wrong. We use our capacities for good and evil. Now when you look at human history you see tremendous achievements, human heroism, beauty in the arts. We see human beings devising incredible technologies that help us to master nature. But then those technologies end up acting back on us in ways such as the Holocaust and atomic bombs.” Do you agree with this line of reasoning? Why or why not? in the forum Discussion Forum

Tue, 16 May 2023 06:00:25 -0400

Reply to Doug Groothuis said, “The Christian faith’s analysis of human nature, I think, is incredibly compelling, because it takes seriously both our limitations and our moral failings, our failures, in many ways, and also takes very seriously our dignity, and our value, and our significance. It doesn’t emphasize one at the expense of the other. Blaise Pascal said we are like deposed kings. And what he means is that biblically we’re not the process of chance evolution, we’re not just an evolved ape…Neither are we gods and goddesses. We’re made in the image and likeness of God. We reflect something of God. We’re rational beings. We’re moral beings. We have purpose, we have intentions, but we’ve also gone wrong. We use our capacities for good and evil. Now when you look at human history you see tremendous achievements, human heroism, beauty in the arts. We see human beings devising incredible technologies that help us to master nature. But then those technologies end up acting back on us in ways such as the Holocaust and atomic bombs.” Do you agree with this line of reasoning? Why or why not?

Agree. Having a Christian worldview and believing in God, this argument makes sense to me. It also tells the grand story of the Bible which is Creation -> Fall -> Redemption. Using this argument pre-supposes God; and thus shows me I need to improve my apologetics.

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion In the video, Vernon Grounds said, “They previously were doubters, and they were cowards, but for now they’ve become courageous witnesses, and it was the French philosopher Pascal, who once remarked, ‘I believe those witnesses were willing to get their throats cut.’ People don’t die for a self-concocted lie. These apostles were willing to die as martyrs, not because they made up a story, but because they had met the risen Christ, and they were convinced of His triumph over death. And that fact transformed them.” Do you agree with Vernon Grounds’ assertion? Explain the reasons for your response. in the forum Discussion Forum

Mon, 15 May 2023 06:03:24 -0400

Reply to In the video, Vernon Grounds said, “They previously were doubters, and they were cowards, but for now they’ve become courageous witnesses, and it was the French philosopher Pascal, who once remarked, ‘I believe those witnesses were willing to get their throats cut.’ People don’t die for a self-concocted lie. These apostles were willing to die as martyrs, not because they made up a story, but because they had met the risen Christ, and they were convinced of His triumph over death. And that fact transformed them.” Do you agree with Vernon Grounds’ assertion? Explain the reasons for your response.

Yes, the fear of Death can be overwhelming, but if you believe and trust in the One who conquered Death and believe that Death no longer has a grip on you, that would change how you view the subject. Literally I haven’t faced death and it’s much easier to think about when not an impending threat. But an honest rational question would be – what… Read more

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion Bob Pyne said: “The best argument for Christianity is the resurrection of Christ. If it happened, then Christianity is true. Then anything which competes against Christianity is false. If the resurrection didn’t happen, then Christianity is false, and anything competing against Christianity as a truth claim may well be true.” Do you agree? Explain your answer. in the forum Discussion Forum

Wed, 10 May 2023 06:28:34 -0400

Reply to Bob Pyne said: “The best argument for Christianity is the resurrection of Christ. If it happened, then Christianity is true. Then anything which competes against Christianity is false. If the resurrection didn’t happen, then Christianity is false, and anything competing against Christianity as a truth claim may well be true.” Do you agree? Explain your answer.

Paul also mentions this, that if the resurrection of Christ did not happen then we [Christians / followers of Jesus] are most miserable of all people and our faith is worthless. How can anything worthless hold its own against a competing idea? On the contrary, if the resurrection of Christ is true it is like the highest trump; and when… Read more

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion R. Douglas Geivett asked: “How old is Christianity? That’s an interesting question. Many people would date the origin of Christianity back to the time of Jesus Christ some 2,000 years ago. Is that when Christianity began? Well, how you answer that question depends on what you think Christianity is. As it happens, Christianity is a religious point of view that is continuous with the history of the Jews, extending all the way back to Abraham and even before that when God was working with the people that He created.” Do you agree with him? Why? in the forum Discussion Forum

Sat, 06 May 2023 07:11:13 -0400

Reply to R. Douglas Geivett asked: “How old is Christianity? That’s an interesting question. Many people would date the origin of Christianity back to the time of Jesus Christ some 2,000 years ago. Is that when Christianity began? Well, how you answer that question depends on what you think Christianity is. As it happens, Christianity is a religious point of view that is continuous with the history of the Jews, extending all the way back to Abraham and even before that when God was working with the people that He created.” Do you agree with him? Why?

I agree with the essence of the meaning; but to clarify that a true believer / follower of Christ is not reduced to just a member of a religion. Jesus Christ was and is the lynchpin of all history (which is His Story). He links the NT with the OT, Judaism with Christianity. Jesus Christ is so much more too – God incarnate come to save… Read more

Kirby Madren replied to the discussion At the beginning of this program we learned: “People have many reasons for rejecting the Christian faith. Some may admire Christ but dislike His followers. Others find it difficult to accept any faith that claims to be the only way to God. Why would anyone limit themselves to only one of the world’s great religions?” How valid are each of these objections? What is your response to each? in the forum Discussion Forum

Sun, 23 Apr 2023 12:57:59 -0400

Reply to At the beginning of this program we learned: “People have many reasons for rejecting the Christian faith. Some may admire Christ but dislike His followers. Others find it difficult to accept any faith that claims to be the only way to God. Why would anyone limit themselves to only one of the world’s great religions?” How valid are each of these objections? What is your response to each?

“Some may admire Christ but dislike His followers.”
-valid point, there are hypocrites in the churches, but there are also hypocrites outside the church and we are all fallen sinners. Jesus didn’t come for the righteous, but to save sinners.

“Others find it difficult to accept any faith that claims to be the only way to God.”
-valid point to… Read more